A few days ago I saw a Honda Insight with HOV stickers (on the bay bridge). Are the rules changing or did this guy know someone or did he just apply and get lucky?<br><br>Anyone know if the rules are changing (for the better)?<br><br>Erik

I, for one, hope the rules aren't changing. HOV lanes are designed to encourage *carpooling* to decrease the number of cars on the road. As virtuous as we hybrid owners are when it comes to fuel economy and environmental impact, unless we're carpooling, we're not earning the HOV lane benefit. I believe the only way to get into a High Occupancy Vehicle lane should be to drive a High Occupancy Vehicle.

&gt;HOV lanes are designed to encourage *carpooling* <br><br>Ah, but why do we want to encourage carpooling? Carpooling in and of itself has no virtue. The reason to promote car pooling is to reduce emisions and to conserve gasoline. Hybrids do that. <br><br>If I'm driving my prius, getting 48 MPG I am getting better MPG PER PERSON than a ford excurion with 2 pasengers getting 11MPG. Yet the excursion is allowed in the lane despite the fact he's burning more than twice as much gas and emitting more than twice as many pollutants.<br><br>The name of the game is reducing the amout of emmisions and gas burned per person mile travelled. This is why electrics are allowed in HOV lanes. <br><br>The key is, understanding what problem you're trying to solve by wanting to decrease the number of cars on the road and avoiding the kneejerk PC reaction that fewer cars are inherently good.

&gt;Ah, but why do we want to encourage carpooling? Carpooling in and of itself has no virtue.<br><br>The purpose is to reduce congestion on the highway. Benefits for fuel economy are secondary gains. The virtue is in reducing the number of cars on the road. That is why in many places they are only operative during rush hour. If their goal was to improve fuel economy there would be no reason to connect them to certain high volume times of day. 2 single drivers in Prii cause twice the traffic congestion as four coworkers in an SUV, and that is the point.<br><br>&gt;The name of the game is reducing the amout of emmisions and gas<br> burned per person mile travelled. This is why electrics are allowed in<br> HOV lanes. <br><br>Actually, the name of the game is alleviation of traffic congestion. That is why in my opinion single drivers of any vehicle should not be rewarded with an HOV lane. As more and more people drive alternative fuel vehicles, allowing all of them to drive their empty cars to and from work everyday without any incentive to carpool as now provided by the HOV lanes will mean more traffic congestion.<br><br>&gt;The key is, understanding what problem you're trying to solve by wanting<br> to decrease the number of cars on the road and avoiding the kneejerk<br> PC reaction that fewer cars are inherently good. <br><br>Indeed--understanding the "problem to be solved" is key. There are more problems from "more cars on the road" than more fuel burned or more noxious gasses emitted. It's wierd to call the value of alleviation of traffic congestion a "knee jerk 'PC' idea." Traffic congestion causes many environmental maladies irrespective of fuel burned.

2<br> single drivers in Prii cause twice the traffic congestion as four coworkers<br> in an SUV, and that is the point.<br><br>Ack! Read "two coworkers," not "four."

&gt;The purpose is to reduce congestion <br>&gt;on the highway.<br><br>According to you...<br><br>&gt;Actually, the name of the game is alleviation <br>&gt;of traffic congestion. That is why in my <br>&gt;opinion single drivers of any vehicle <br>&gt;should not be rewarded with an <br>&gt;HOV lane.<br><br>Defacto, clean air vehicles ARE allowed in the HOV lanes so therefor despite YOUR opinion to the contrary, the state of California does not consider the name of the game to be traffic alleviation otherwise clean air vehicles would NOT be allowed to use HOV lanes.

This law reminds me of the ?Handicap Parking? law. I have nothing against people with disabilities getting closer or larger parking spaces, but I don?t understand why they are exempt from putting money in the parking meters. Just because they have a disability, does not mean they don?t have to put the quarter in the meter. From what I have been told by several CA Govt. Agencies, is that the HOV Lanes were originally intended to eliminate traffic congestion. Allowing any vehicle to travel in them with less than two people regardless of the type of vehicle is not what they were intended for. If they want to go ahead and allow individuals in Hybrids or Alternative Fuel Vehicles to use the HOV lanes with one person only GREAT!, but that was not what the initial intention. Hey, maybe we should propose that alternative vehicles be exempt from metered parking and that vehicles with handicap placards be allowed on the HOV lanes ?. hmmmm

Could it be that you are both right. In my limited experience with HOV lanes, they are often underutilized while the rest of the traffic remains congested. Maybe they are thinking that by allowing clean air vehicles in HOV, they are continuing to reward lower emmisions use per passenger, and still helping to decongest the non-HOV lanes. What they will do when clean air vehicles become abundant is the real question. Maybe they will create another lane for only high occupancy clean air vehicles ;)

The idea was that when the law was passed to allow non emission vehicles in the HOV lanes in CA, was that the cars at the time were electric and had a limited amount of power. Sitting in stop and go traffic meant that the car that went 100 miles was only able to go 10 miles between "fillups".

We don't have HOV lanes in Illinois, so consider this a remark from a disinterested observer:<br><br>Isn't the reason people want to get stickers to drive solo in the HOV lanes precisely because those lanes get you through congested traffic faster? And if hybrids really catch on and there are more and more people driving them solo in the HOV lanes, won't the traffic be just as bad there?<br><br>Barbara

Both concepts are true; eliminate smog and eliminate traffic. <br>With either one of these concepts a single driver in a Prius really shouldn't use the HOV lane. The Prius does create some smog while driving. It gets better gas mileage in the stop and go condition of the metering light or traffic. Unfortunately the Honda creates less smog if allowed in the HOV lane. <br><br>I have a weird condition on my commute. A freeway interchange has a metering light on it. Granted that this is a begining of the freeway. But a metering light on an interchange? Anyway I sit and wait about 10 minutes for my turn at the go light. I see Honda's and EV-1 using the HOV lane and they don't have to wait 10 minutes.<br><br>So should I request a HOV pass for my Prius?<br><br>My thoughts is NO. But 10 minutes savings on a commute of 90 minutes sounds pretty good.

You could request the HOV pass and use it to save the 10 minute wait getting onto the freeway, then NOT drive in the HOV lanes once you're on.<br><br>Barbara

Emission savings does not have to come at the expense of more congestion in HOV lanes, as some of you think.<br><br>Hybrids are better for the environment, as all of us agree, and reduce our dependence on fossil fuels. As a matter of public policy, elected officials in some states have decided to incentivise the purchase of hybrid vehicles, which is laudable because they cost more. One way to do this is to offer credits or deductions from state income taxes, as some states have (VA, in my case). Another way is to open HOV lanes to allow travel time savings. A 13 mile commute into DC takes me 30 minutes in the HOV lanes, but about 50 minutes in conventional lanes. Those 40 minutes I save are very valuable to me, moreso than the few hundred I save over 12 months.<br><br>To address the issue of HOV lanes becoming congested because of hybrid vehicles being driven by one person, the VA legislature has written into the law that they have to re-approve the legislation every three years. If it turns out that there are too many solo hybrids in the HOV lanes, they let the law sunset.<br><br>So, as long as there is available capacity in the HOV lanes, everyone wins with this system. Seems like some of our politicians have though it through.