Priusman said now that global production is 3000 per month Toyota has almost reached the break even point on the price. That's fantastic news. And he said the 2.4L Estima van shows the hybrid system can handle the big vehicles.<br><br>So Toyota could ramp up production and make money at very little differential cost to the consumer. Now that they've seen the voracious demand for the Prius (at least at low production runs), they should be flooding the market and having a noticable effect on air quality and fuel consumption in just a few years. Other manufacturers will follow on too, driving down costs even further and the whole thing will snowball.

A friend of mine brought up the following point/question. If I am driving a modest mileage car now (20/28), if I want to trade in on a Prius, how much energy would be used, and how much pollution created building me a new Prius? How long would I have to drive my Prius in order to break even on the energy/pollution front? <br><br>Let's not even consider the energy/pollution savings of handing over my car to someone who is (hopefully) driving an even lower mileage car.<br><br>This really got me thinking, because up till now, I was only considering my own driving and budget. When maybe, we should be viewing it all as a microcosm that includes where I get the new car from, and where my old car goes....<br><br>Just some more to think about.<br><br>Ordered 8/1<br>Promised in 3-4 months<br>Got the manual 9/27<br>Still waiting....<br>(and driving my Suburban)<br><br>Jim

Might have changed since I read the article 10+ years ago, but at the time it was shown that solar cells never generate enough energy to offset the energy used in their actual production. I guess you have to figure, if they are going to build a car, anyway, and if I am going to buy one, anyway, then it is better if the car is more fuel efficient.

"Now that they've seen the voracious demand for the Prius (at least at low production runs), they should be flooding the market and having a noticable effect on air quality and fuel consumption in just a few years."<br><br>I'd like to think that but my understanding is that under current laws, that probably isn't the case. The bottom line is that our purchases of the Prius "subsidizes" the purchase of gas-guzzling SUVs by urbanites who don't need them, since Toyota only has to maintain an average gas mileage overall across the different model versions. <br><br>Personally I think the laws should be beefed up across North America, like what California is doing. I think SUVs are great if they're going to be used as SUVs, but it still irritates me to see pure urban dwellers drive their SUVs to the grocery store and to work downtown. I still find it strange that most SUVs out there can't even be used off-road.

While Keynes, Marx and Samuelson would agree with the basic "energy cost" valuation below, Jimbo's question is of "pollution cost". I'll guess the pollution cost to make a Prius is low, since all of Toyota's factories are ISO 14001 certified. If the car you're trading in is a Saturn, that's a wash at best: Saturn is first in the world with not only ISO 14001 but an initiative to drive all their suppliers to ISO 14001 as well. If it's just about any other make, its pollution cost and recycling value would be much worse. I think the best we can hope for, anyway, is that your old, moderately-polluting car entering the used market will displace an even older, highly-polluting car on the roads.<br><br>--Bob<br><br>&gt;&gt;If I am driving a modest mileage<br>&gt;car now (20/28), if I want to trade in on a <br>&gt;Prius, how much energy would be used, and how <br>&gt;much pollution created building me a new Prius? <br>&gt;How long would I have to drive my Prius in order <br>&gt;to break even on the energy/pollution front...<br><br>&gt;If you take a simplistic view, the cost of any manufactured item is the cost of energy required to build it. ...So the answer in the case of a Prius is the cost of energy is about $20,000 ...

&gt;&gt;If I am driving a modest mileage<br>&gt;car now (20/28), if I want to trade in on a <br>&gt;Prius, how much energy would be used, and how <br>&gt;much pollution created building me a new Prius? <br>&gt;How long would I have to drive my Prius in order <br>&gt;to break even on the energy/pollution front...<br><br>For those for which the environmental aspects of the Prius are important in their car purchase choice, I believe that there is an additional "environmental" advantage to buying a Prius (or Insight) to consider. If you believe that hybrids will help the environment then the goal would seem to be (from an environmental perspective) to get more hybrids out on the road. It is my guess (and it is only a guess) that many people will be willing to consider a Prius or Insight if A) they knew that they existed and B) they were exposed to them and could see that are not all that different than what they are used to. I have seen several posts where Prius and Insight owners are getting a lot of questions from people regarding there car. I know that I will let anyone in my office drive my Prius when I get it. They've already been asking about it (and seem genuinely interested in finding out about it.) So, if you buy a Prius you are getting the obvious energy/emission benefits and very well might be helping to get others to do the same. I think that if the energy/pollution issue is important in your decision on whether or not to buy a hybrid, then you might want to consider these other benefits as well.<br><br>Martin